DE, Why Bother?

[Trackrat]

Originally Posted by mooty

great post trackrate.
i have been and still am in both. let me shed some light here.

that's exactly why i hate to pick a class then buy a car. i like to pick a car then race. i dont care about winning $5 trophies. if there's a $10M purse at the end of the day, i be interested. but for $5 i like to do my OWN rules and fun.

More good stuff, thanks John! You have been/are doing both so valuable feedback.

Let me be clear that I am sure I would love some wheel to wheel and may yet do it but I thought it might be helpful to air the topic and discuss it rationally

Interesting to read the thoughts and opinions.

[TRAKCAR]

Late to the thread, but great read.

OT, but Mooty, bigger is better: This is the engine you need: http://www.sporttruckrv.com/TruckDetail/AU2422

I do race and have the trophy's: http://www.24hoursoflemons.com/
Won overall; Got $1500.00 in nickels
Won in class.
Won price for doing the most with the least.
Won for whatever, I forget.

A blast to do on the cheap. had a TON of fun.

But racing is work and I already have a job.
Let's say I go racing; Must have coaching, must analyse data, must practice, must setup car, must have newest and best. Everything must be perfect. Other cheat. Should you??

If you don't do all the above you're a loser and are getting lapped. So next time you do it ALL. Get t-boned off the track in T1 and go home. I have seen enough racing and the trauma is creates to stay away from it all.

DE; I must only show up and refill tank and drink beer. Yes, I'm a bit hung over or a lot, car is a bit pushy and I should change tire pressure and sway bar but I am to laze to bend down, just drive around the problem. Have fun. It gets to hot, you skip a session, etc. etc.

[Dell]

Originally Posted by Trackrat

Wow! That is one of the best posts I have read anywhere in a very long time. Thanks Dell for taking the time and making the effort to create it. Very interesting and helpful to walk alongside one man's journey and experience the thought process. Certainly valuable perspective for me as I explore and chart my own path.

To each his own I say and whatever makes you happy is what you should do. "Know thyself"

Very welcome. I was afraid that maybe it was a bit long winded. But then again, those that really want the input and want hear others experience will read it.

I'm hoping at no point did I come across in a way that I felt I was "all that and a bag of chips" and that I was too good for racing. I know there are plenty of drivers that would blow my doors off but I just felt that being brutally honest was the best way to get my point across. It's just hard to know how others will interpret your words. At least I know here I won't be attacked like those that frequently do on Rennlist.

GT2GT3CUP.org is truly a place I feel like we can be honest and nobody will take joy in insulting you. What a great community!

Originally Posted by TRAKCAR

But racing is work and I already have a job.
Let's say I go racing; Must have coaching, must analyse data, must practice, must setup car, must have newest and best. Everything must be perfect. Other cheat. Should you??

If you don't do all the above you're a loser and are getting lapped. So next time you do it ALL. Get t-boned off the track in T1 and go home. I have seen enough racing and the trauma is creates to stay away from it all.

DE; I must only show up and refill tank and drink beer. Yes, I'm a bit hung over or a lot, car is a bit pushy and I should change tire pressure and sway bar but I am to laze to bend down, just drive around the problem. Have fun. It gets to hot, you skip a session, etc. etc.

Bingo! That sums it up perfectly and a point I agree with 100%. I said in my writeup as well that racing just felt like work and DE feels like vacation. If you want to do well in racing you have to really work at it (as you said). If you don't then why are you even racing?

I much prefer to just fill up the tank, drink beer, and not give a damn if you forgot to adjust your pressures.

Besides, I have nobody to impress anymore except my 1 and 3 year old boys.....my future racers

[FTS]

The answers to this thread has been surprising to me, I was expecting a lot more in favor of racing, getting ready for racing, etc. I think we are probably a little too small of a community just yet.

Dell, really eloquently put. And I am so much like Peter, I just want to drive and want the car to be reliable not to mess with it. The social aspect of a DE as well as instructing makes my weekend every single time.

Originally Posted by Dell

GT2GT3CUP.org is truly a place I feel like we can be honest and nobody will take joy in insulting you. What a great community!

I, on behalf of all the people that put their sweat into this, truly appreciate the words and so glad you feel that way. Thank you, it means a lot to us.

[Dell]

Fatih, I stopped posting regularly in the racing/DE forum over 2 years ago for the very things I stated above. This place (GT2GT3cup.org) for us to share info reminds me much more of the 996GT3 subforum on Rennlist. There is an immense amount of repsect and commraderie amongst the guys. You rarely ever see a smackdown there. The racing/DE forum it is a daily occurrence and just makes you not want to visit.

Just 3 short days from now I'll be on my balcony watching the climbing esses with a cold beer in my hand!

[TRAKCAR]

Just 3 short days from now I'll be on my balcony watching the climbing esses with a cold beer in my hand!

That's what I'm talking about!
Drive a little on the track, stare at beatiful cars, have some fun afterwards with people who can still stand you after talking cars for hours on end ;-) and contemplate that there are really a lot of people out there who's life really sucks a lot more then your because they either don't know how or can't enjoy life.

[Dell]

Peter, I just got a good laugh out of that gif! I was waiting for an image to load thinking my computer was a bit slow and finally realized that the image waiting to load is actually the spinning progress image. Touche'

[NickW]

Originally Posted by Dell

... Going to a DE is almost like going on vacation where racing is like going to work. The stress level at the DE is almost non existent. The money spent is just a fraction of a race weekend. I have learned how to give point-by's .

Probably the most important point of the post in my opinion.

I race karts- situps and a bit of laydown, in the WKA NRRS (National Road Race Series). At the speeds we go in that series we are very serious about the prep level and driver ability. DE is a vacation compared to racing.

My progression went from DE, to open wheel, to road racing karts, and now probably back to DE in the long term.

In DE there is no stress, there is no competition, the only thing pushing you is yourself. I liken a DE day to a ski resort day- you can have as much fun as you want- you can rip the backcountry black diamonds if you have the ability and equipment, or play on the groomer greens if you're so inclined. I am not going to be the next MSC so I don't worry about racing at the sharp end of the grid anymore, so I race for fun (karts are way cheaper than open wheel cars).

DE is very different from racing. Racing is about competing within a very defined set of rules- DE is about learning how to drive better.

In the end, life is too short to worry about what the next guy thinks as long as you're keeping to yourself.

[TRAKCAR]

Dell, I saw it in my reply. How did that get there???
I thought I deleted it and I don't see it now. I was not trying to anoy you LOL.

[Trackrat]

Originally Posted by FTS

The answers to this thread has been surprising to me, I was expecting a lot more in favor of racing, getting ready for racing, etc. I think we are probably a little too small of a community just yet.

Dell, really eloquently put. And I am so much like Peter, I just want to drive and want the car to be reliable not to mess with it. The social aspect of a DE as well as instructing makes my weekend every single time.

I, on behalf of all the people that put their sweat into this, truly appreciate the words and so glad you feel that way. Thank you, it means a lot to us.

Hanging out with track pals is "validity" enough for me! Glad the Registry forum is starting on a good foot.

+1 as usual for my friend Fatih.

Originally Posted by Dell

Fatih, I stopped posting regularly in the racing/DE forum over 2 years ago for the very things I stated above. This place (GT2GT3cup.org) for us to share info reminds me much more of the 996GT3 subforum on Rennlist. There is an immense amount of repsect and commraderie amongst the guys. You rarely ever see a smackdown there. The racing/DE forum it is a daily occurrence and just makes you not want to visit.

I am so totally not into all the BS smackdown stuff. Have fun, respect others, even if they order ASS seats in a GT3 Understand that not everyone has the same risk tolerance and goals. But we all love us some Porsche! lol

Originally Posted by TRAKCAR

That's what I'm talking about!
Drive a little on the track, stare at beatiful cars, have some fun afterwards with people who can still stand you after talking cars for hours on end ;-) and contemplate that there are really a lot of people out there who's life really sucks a lot more then your because they either don't know how or can't enjoy life.

Well said Peter, well said.

Have fun, be safe, enjoy.

[Dell]

Originally Posted by TRAKCAR

Dell, I saw it in my reply. How did that get there???
I thought I deleted it and I don't see it now. I was not trying to anoy you LOL.

So you were messing with me!

[jurnes]

Originally Posted by Trackrat

Some folks are of the opinion that DE has its limits. If you tweak your car enough, you are wasting your money and should just buy a "race car". Real men (and ladies) graduate to wheel-to-wheel racing.

While always willing to keep an open mind and change my opinion at any time I enjoy DE and Time Trials and choose not to move to wheel to wheel for the following reasons.

1. DE is no pressure and very relaxing.
2. Lower cost of participation. Much fewer consumables.
3. Less chance of car to car contact.
4. Less chance of catastrophic crash due to wheel to wheel contact.
5. A DE car can be and usually is street legal. A pure race car is not street legal. A Cup car can never be street legal.
6. DE gives you a whole lot more track time and events during the year to participate in.
7. You can make any changes to your car that you like as there is no rule book to restrict you.

During my GT3RS build project over the winter, adding a cage, new suspension, race exhaust I frequently worried if I was going too far over the top. Folks asked me if I was just wasting my money on a street car.

But I must say, I now enjoy DE more than ever and the car is a pure joy to track. Plus I have the reward of tuning the car exactly as I like it. To me DE is as valid a pursuit as anything else?

What do you think about this topic and what is right for you?

I like them both: one complementing the other. As to the expense of one vs the other: I have only raced wheel to wheel in an old Porsche 944 (24hrs Lemons), which gives me some close (sometimes very close) car to car performance driving with very little capital outlay. My DE monitory investment is substantial.

[jenk12m]

I would love to race, just to say I've done ot and see how really slow I am

[Izzone]

Racers

End of day analyze track data, try to squeeze the last second out of pratice video to improve the next day. On track constantly watching mirros to make sure no one passes

DE guys I hang out with

End of the day tell lies about Traqmate lap times, while using beer to lower the number. On track I am constantly watching for Orange or White RS's to throw up a block

[mooty]

NEVER mod dell. good one.


but " Going to a DE is almost like going on vacation where racing is like going to work." is right on. it is EXACTLY what i feel.